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Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists

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Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
Started at 04:36pm on the 10th October, 2018 by Adrian
Adrian Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
While our hosts' on-line parts books are most helpful for the owners of post-war Redditch models and official UK import Indian Bullets, there are going to be a few cases where someone has an Indian home-market model which has found their way to our shores, and some head scratching will ensue.

I know our hosts have SOME parts for e.g. the AVL Thunderbird, but it really does help if you know exactly what you're looking for. The following is a link to a set of on-line parts lists which seem to cover most of the pre-EFI home market stuff.

http://www.jainenfield.com/sparecat.html

A.
Posted: 04:36pm 10th October, 2018
Wheaters Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
Adrian, Thanks - having one the aforementioned Indian home market bikes (2004 350 Bullet Electra) I was interested to see an alternative parts list. However, it doesn't seem to include my bike (albeit some parts are common with other RE bikes). Mine has a different primary chaincase which is held in place by a series of screws and has a composite paper gasket, rather than a large 'O' ring seal and centre bolt. It caused some confusion at H's counter until I showed a photo of it. It appears to be the similar to the casing on the electric start Electras sold in UK, but mine is kickstart only, with electronic ignition and no distributor. An interim model? I don't know.
Posted: 07:36pm 10th October, 2018
Adrian Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
There were several different versions of the RE (India) 350 Electra.

Early ones from 2002-2003 were four speed, right-foot shift, kick-start only with Capacitor Discharge Ignition, using a modified form of the standard Indian copy of the Lucas alternator.

These were replaced by another right-foot shifting 4 speed model, this time with the external rotor alternator, stator fixed to the outer primary chaincase and TCI rather than CDI ignition. The outer chaincases on these were indeed almost indentical to those on the Electra-X, being held on by ten 6mm allen screws around the periphery. The only difference with the outer casing was that with no the left-foot gear change shaft it wasn't drilled through. You can see on the casting where it would go, though. The majority of privately imported 350 Electras in this country seem to be this version.

THEN we come to the 5 speed kick start version, but left-foot shifting as per the standard 5 speed gearbox, so the primary cases on these ARE drilled through. These bikes seem quite rare, even in India.

Finally we come to the 5 Speed ES, a sort of 350 version of the Sixty-5 but with TCI ignition.

I probably should get out more...

A.
Posted: 08:47pm 10th October, 2018
Wheaters Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
Yes, mine is the later type with TCI ignition and the stator on the casing and it has a right hand gear change. Now I've got it over the valve seat recession problem I had soon after running it (it only had 3,000 miles on the clock when I bought it) and improved the slow flowing fuel tap it's great to ride. I've put knobbly trials type tyres on it and it's great for my favourite pastime, i.e. plodding about the Peak district including exploring legal off-tarmac sections. This year I've put a lot more miles on it than my Honda CB750 Nighthawk, which says a lot for it. While was sorting out the valve seat problem I also gas flowed the head and it now goes very nicely, certainly quicker than before. The one thing I'd still like to do is to optimise the ignition timing but I'm not certain that this can be adjusted without dismantling the primary side and even then, there's no easy way of measuring what's going on until it's all put back together and running again. Very much trial and error and not ideal due to the need to replace the chaincase gasket each time!
Posted: 10:13pm 11th October, 2018
Adrian Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
You could put gasket goo on one side and grease on the other. As it has the same sort of TCI ignition as the Electra-X you might get a small boost by replacing the black box with the Suzuki GS125 version, which as been used successfully on the Electra-X. It has a bit more advance and retard. To vary the fixed(!) timing with your existing TCI you can either use stepped alternator keys from our host or carefully elongate the mounting holes for the trigger coil bracket.

The 350 Electra is quite highly thought of amongst classic 350 models, shame it wasn't an official import.

A.
Posted: 10:35pm 11th October, 2018
Wheaters Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
Adrian, Are you saying that the Suzuki TCI box will advance and retard the advance wrt to engine rpm? If so, it might be well worth trying one just for the hell of it. I have no idea if the standard box has fixed timing, I've found no information on the workings of it and as far as I can see there is no way of checking the timing with the engine running, a first for me after over forty five years of working on engines since my teens. It is quite an unusual looking bike by today's standards and it does attract a surprising amount of attention. I often go to Matlock Bath, a well known Derbyshire biker haunt. I park it up on the main road and it always amuses me to see how many riders of very new, very expensive modern bikes come up to look at it and ask questions.
Posted: 10:27am 12th October, 2018
Adrian Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
When I say fixed timing I refer to the mechanical bits and bobs. The advance and retard is carried out electronically in the TCI black box, unlike with the old points-behind-the-cylinder set-up there is no physical means of adjustment, unless you use stepped alternator keys or elongate the trigger mounting holes as mentioned above.

The Suzuki TCI box was tried out by Bullet Whisperer while tuning an Electra-X (same sort of ignition as your 350 Electra), and he found it had a few more degrees of advance as well as retard. I was also sent one by Rex Caunt of Rex Caunt Racing, once I'd figured out the wiring it worked very well. Our hosts used to sell them too. This was a few years ago now, and I fear they may be obsolete as far as OEM supplies are concerned, so you'd be looking at either a used one or a pattern item off ebay if you want one.

Don't let anyone confuse you with talk of the green TCI box fitted to later Electra-X models, there were introduced specifically due problems with backfiring electric start engines killing the sprag clutch, not relevant in a kick start only bike.

Apart from the ignition/alternator/drive side mainshaft/primary chaincases/nice metallic paint job the 350 Electra is still a pretty standard Bullet, so most of the tuning goodies applicable to the standard 350 can be used on yours.

A.
Posted: 01:01pm 12th October, 2018
Wheaters Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
Adrian, I'm very grateful for all your info on this model, there's very little published elsewhere. I had seen the ignition retard device in the "H's" catalogue (and discarded the idea) but I understand why the bikes with a sprag clutch starter might need one to prevent engine kickback. I had considered designing and fitting a manual advance/retard setup like my old BSA A7SS had but tbh, since the lost compression issue is cured the bike now starts first or second kick and rarely kicks back. Having said that, as a dyed in the wool "engine tinkerer" I would like to confirm I'm getting the absolute best out of this engine (hence me gas flowing the cylinder head while it was off the bike for the new valve seat to be fitted). This is the first time in almost fifty years of owning bikes that that I've had one where there is no obvious way to check and adjust the ignition timing! I have read that this ignition system is actually very reliable - I hope so! Cheers, Paul.
Posted: 03:16pm 12th October, 2018
Adrian Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
By all accounts the 4-speed TCI 350 Electra was a bike they just got right (premature valve seat wear apart), though considering how long Chennai had been building 350 Bullets there was no excuse for not doing so.

Now if you really WANT old-school ignition you can move your engine internals with the head and barrel to a set of normal Bullet crankcases and have the old points set-up, you could even go for the hard-core option of fitting a Lucas N1 magneto with manual advance and retard. ;) You would however lose the accuracy of crank driven ignition due to the inevitable slop/backlash of the timing pinions. That said, my next project involves building an Electra-X engine into a set of classic 500 Bullet crankcases so that I can run a Lucas SR1 magneto. There's no helping some people... A.
Posted: 06:26pm 12th October, 2018
Wheaters Subject: Indian Bullet (pre-UCE/EFI) Parts Lists
I like "retro" but no way would I go back that far in technology! Easier to buy another bike, I'd say! ;-)
Posted: 07:29pm 12th October, 2018

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